Feminist SF Wiki - User contributions [en]

Naamen Gobert Tilahun

2007-10-29T03:27:41Z

69.181.60.69: New page: An aspiring Science-Fiction/Fantasy author currently completing his B.A. in creative writing at San Francisco State University.

An aspiring Science-Fiction/Fantasy author currently completing his B.A. in creative writing at San Francisco State University.

Why Is The Universe So Damn White? (WisCon 31 panel)

2007-07-29T21:55:27Z

69.181.60.69: /* Notes, transcripts, etc. */

66 Why Is The Universe So Damn White?

Reading, Viewing, and Critiquing SF&F•Senate A• Saturday, 1:00-2:15 p.m.

It's great that there are many great SF shows on television with diverse main casts. [[Stargate]], [[Firefly (TV series)|Firefly]], [[Battlestar Galactica (2004 TV series)|Battlestar]], [[Buffy the Vampire Slayer|Buffy]]—in each you will find ethnic minorities in major roles. However, if you look in the background it doesn't take long to notice that even though the main players aren't all white, everyone else seems to be. Finding a planet full of 'white' people is easy, but what about the planets with Black people, or Laotians, or Pacific Islanders? Then you run into the problem of how ethnic minorities are portrayed, both in terms of the main characters and the Aliens of the Week. Why is it so hard for television, which has taken the first step in being inclusive, to take that next step and actually portray a diverse Universe? Why is the Universe so damn white and what can we do to change that?

M: [[K Tempest Bradford]], [[Wendy Bradley]], [[Kate Elliott]], [[Naamen Gobert Tilahun]]

==Comments, notes==
* [ http://jonquil.livejournal.com/574237.html Jonquil]

==Notes, transcripts, etc.==
Panel notes from Janice Dawley.

Tempest thought of this panel because of the Stargate panel last year, when people were very confused at mention of race issues on the show.

She asks what genre shows each panelist has watched & seen this problem in?

Kate: she wonders if we have moved on at all from the original [[Star Trek]], though there has been some progress in the foreground characters ([[Battlestar Galactica (2004 TV series)|Battlestar Galactica]] with Asian people).

Naamen: Battlestar Galactica with its “planet of the black fundies” (*audience laughter*), [[Stargate Atlantis]], [[Buffy the Vampire Slayer (TV series)|Buffy]]. [[Torchwood (TV series)|Torchwood]] as counter example.

Wendy: [[Stargate SG-1]], [[The Sentinel]] (she hangs her head and admits she writes fanfiction for it). She points out the stereotype of black judges and captains. She thinks the British problem is slightly different because there are different racial categories in England than in the U.S.

Tempest: [[Doctor Who]]: [[Martha Jones|Martha]] is awesome! The show is much more integrated than any American SF show she can think of (except for season one [[Lost (TV series)|Lost]]). Stargate SG-1 (she had to give up on it after the Christians showed up), Stargate Atlantis, season one; doesn’t like Battlestar Galactica; mentions [[Firefly (TV series)|Firefly]]’s Chinese cultural background, but total lack of Chinese people.

Where did you first notice the problem?

Naamen: Buffy. Southern California is full of people of color, so where were they? Tokenism: only one of any target group.

Kate: Much more sensitized to these issues since she moved to Hawaii; when she comes to the mainland, she really notices the whiteness.

Wendy: The Epcot Phenomenon: when characters on an SF show encounter an encapsulation of what an entire culture is supposed to be about. Examples includes [[The Man from Uncle]] and Stargate, with its Mongol culture, “Monty Python’s medieval village”, etc. “A rubbish concept!”

Kate: Praises cultural specificity rather than a character just being a placeholder. [[Star Trek: Deep Space Nine]] and Captain Sisko’s concrete background.

Tempest: A lot of that was because Avery Brooks insisted on it. Most shows want to erase racial issues. “Where did Tuvok come from? Where is the island of black Vulcans?”

Naamen: Martha on Dr. Who is special because she acknowledges racial issues. When she time travels into the past, she wants to know if she will be taken away as a slave.

Wendy: Television lacks representation in general. Where are the “ugly” people? “Who’s the only fat guy on television? Yay, Hurley!” She questions whether the lack of people of color is racist rather than a symptom of a general problem.

Tempest: Marketing concerns driving casting decisions. White men perceived as necessary to appeal to the magic demographic.

Kate: Reads quote re: new adaptation of “Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee” and the need for a white or part white character to “carry the audience through this project”. *audience boos*

Tempest recounts her conversation with Ronald Moore at the Nebula Awards ceremony about the lack of people of color in the background on Battlestar Galactica. His reaction: “That’s a fair criticism,” though he does blame filming in Vancouver somewhat. He doesn’t consider that an excuse, though.

Naamen: He asked Moore at another convention about Gemenon and the “magical negros” phenomenon. Moore said he had noticed that, but Lucy Lawless, who was also on the panel, jumped in and said, “She was the best actress for the role.” Immediately defensive!

Tempest: Mentions the [http://ofcolour.blogspot.com/ People of Colour SF Carnival].

Audience: How does Russell Davies get away with making the new Doctor Who so diverse?

Wendy: Because of his successful track record and because he films in Cardiff, not London.

An audience member notes Homicide: Life on the Street as a non-genre example of the same thing. It had an exceptionally diverse cast for a police show, and was filmed in Baltimore instead of one of the industry hub cities. Getting out of the execs' immediate vicinity can help.

Audience: Naamen, I wanted to know how you felt about Gunn in the TV series Angel?

Naamen: He stopped watching [[Angel (TV series)|Angel]] because of what happened to Gunn: they had to use magic to make him smart.

Tempest: She appreciates [[Joss Whedon]] for getting the gender stuff right, but wishes he could get more than one thing right.

The urge to criticize is not entirely negative

Who is responsible? (producers, writers, directors?)

Wendy: Television is not made for us (the viewers) -- it’s made for advertisers. We are the product being delivered to the advertisers.

Audience member: “Is it a problem that I don’t care about the lack of people of color Buffy and Angel?”

Wendy: It’s all about coding. You can map yourself onto a character, even if they’re male, white, etc. until one day... “Hang on! I’m not going to grow up to be John Wayne!”

Audience member: Vancouver is actually full of Asians, so Ron Moore’s comment is bullshit.

Jacqueline: Fandom (Stargate: Atlantis) gets annoyed when actors of color are pointed out as such, because they are really ''aliens''.

How to fix problems?

Kate: Envision the future you want to live.

Tempest: Doesn’t have much faith that big media can be affected, because we don’t have access to the producers.

Wendy: Buy a bunch of copies of [[Writing the Other]] and mail them to TV producers (she’s serious).

Tayla & Chakotay as “native guides”, whereas Neelix is Sponge Bob.

Lack of people of color is bad world building. It “breaks the world” to have an all-white Sunnydale.

Tempest calls for media creative presence at conventions like WisCon. It would be great if creators had to attend panels like this to remain relevant.

Women, blacks, gays & lesbians in production positions don’t guarantee authenticity.

[[Heroes (TV series)|Heroes]] comes in for serious criticism.
*black criminal (D.L.)
*dead black woman (Simone)
*Latino drug addict (Isaac)
*the Haitian with no name

final wrap up:

Kate: “cultures are in a continual process of change”

Naamen: wants half Asian, half Latina lesbian woman as next Dr. Who incarnation

Tempest: The universe is so damn white because we let it be. Be activists! Get involved with blogging ([http://thehathorlegacy.info/ The Hathor Legacy], the People of Colour SF carnival). Write the stories, write the books, and when Hollywood comes calling don’t assume it’s going to be OK because Phillippa Boyens is involved, like [[Ursula K. Le Guin]] did with the SciFi production of [[Earthsea]].

== External Links ==

* [http://blog.wired.com/underwire/2007/05/fanblogging_wis.html Annalee Newitz] at UnderWire blog
* [http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x982281 same post, different thread]

[[Category:WisCon 31 panels]]
[[Category:Race and gender]]

Why Is The Universe So Damn White? (WisCon 31 panel)

2007-06-02T15:33:32Z

69.181.60.69: /* Notes, transcripts, etc. */

66 Why Is The Universe So Damn White?

Reading, Viewing, and Critiquing SF&F•Senate A• Saturday, 1:00-2:15 p.m.

It's great that there are many great SF shows on television with diverse main casts. [[Stargate]], [[Firefly (TV series)|Firefly]], [[Battlestar Galactica (2004 TV series)|Battlestar]], [[Buffy the Vampire Slayer|Buffy]]—in each you will find ethnic minorities in major roles. However, if you look in the background it doesn't take long to notice that even though the main players aren't all white, everyone else seems to be. Finding a planet full of 'white' people is easy, but what about the planets with Black people, or Laotians, or Pacific Islanders? Then you run into the problem of how ethnic minorities are portrayed, both in terms of the main characters and the Aliens of the Week. Why is it so hard for television, which has taken the first step in being inclusive, to take that next step and actually portray a diverse Universe? Why is the Universe so damn white and what can we do to change that?

M: [[K Tempest Bradford]], [[Wendy Bradley]], [[Kate Elliott]], [[Naamen Gobert Tilahun]]

==Comments, notes==
* [ http://jonquil.livejournal.com/574237.html Jonquil]

==Notes, transcripts, etc.==
Panel notes from Janice Dawley.

Tempest thought of this panel because of the Stargate panel last year, when people were very confused at mention of race issues on the show.

She asks what genre shows each panelist has watched & seen this problem in?

Kate: she wonders if we have moved on at all from the original [[Star Trek]], though there has been some progress in the foreground characters ([[Battlestar Galactica (2004 TV series)|Battlestar Galactica]] with Asian people).

Naamen: Battlestar Galactica with its “planet of the black fundies” (*audience laughter*), [[Stargate Atlantis]], [[Buffy the Vampire Slayer (TV series)|Buffy]]. [[Torchwood (TV series)|Torchwood]] as counter example.

Wendy: [[Stargate SG-1]], [[The Sentinel]] (she hangs her head and admits she writes fanfiction for it). She points out the stereotype of black judges and captains. She thinks the British problem is slightly different because there are different racial categories in England than in the U.S.

Tempest: [[Doctor Who]]: [[Martha Jones|Martha]] is awesome! The show is much more integrated than any American SF show she can think of (except for season one [[Lost (TV series)|Lost]]). Stargate SG-1 (she had to give up on it after the Christians showed up), Stargate Atlantis, season one; doesn’t like Battlestar Galactica; mentions [[Firefly (TV series)|Firefly]]’s Chinese cultural background, but total lack of Chinese people.

Where did you first notice the problem?

Naamen: Buffy. Southern California is full of people of color, so where were they? Tokenism: only one of any target group.

Kate: Much more sensitized to these issues since she moved to Hawaii; when she comes to the mainland, she really notices the whiteness.

Wendy: The Epcot Phenomenon: when characters on an SF show encounter an encapsulation of what an entire culture is supposed to be about. Examples includes [[The Man from Uncle]] and Stargate, with its Mongol culture, “Monty Python’s medieval village”, etc. “A rubbish concept!”

Kate: Praises cultural specificity rather than a character just being a placeholder. [[Star Trek: Deep Space Nine]] and Captain Sisko’s concrete background.

Tempest: A lot of that was because Avery Brooks insisted on it. Most shows want to erase racial issues. “Where did Tuvok come from? Where is the island of black Vulcans?”

Naamen: Martha on Dr. Who is special because she acknowledges racial issues. When she time travels into the past, she wants to know if she will be taken away as a slave.

Wendy: Television lacks representation in general. Where are the “ugly” people? “Who’s the only fat guy on television? Yay, Hurley!” She questions whether the lack of people of color is racist rather than a symptom of a general problem.

Tempest: Marketing concerns driving casting decisions. White men perceived as necessary to appeal to the magic demographic.

Kate: Reads quote re: new adaptation of “Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee” and the need for a white or part white character to “carry the audience through this project”. *audience boos*

Tempest recounts her conversation with Ronald Moore at the Nebula Awards ceremony about the lack of people of color in the background on Battlestar Galactica. His reaction: “That’s a fair criticism,” though he does blame filming in Vancouver somewhat. He doesn’t consider that an excuse, though.

Naamen: He asked Moore at another convention about Geminon and the “magical negros” phenomenon. Moore said he had noticed that, but Lucy Lawless, who was also on the panel, jumped in and said, “She was the best actress for the role.” Immediately defensive!

Tempest: Mentions the [http://ofcolour.blogspot.com/ People of Colour SF Carnival].

Audience: How does Russell Davies get away with making the new Doctor Who so diverse?

Wendy: Because of his successful track record and because he films in Cardiff, not London.

An audience member notes Homicide: Life on the Street as a non-genre example of the same thing. It had an exceptionally diverse cast for a police show, and was filmed in Baltimore instead of one of the industry hub cities. Getting out of the execs' immediate vicinity can help.

Naamen: He stopped watching [[Angel (TV series)|Angel]] because of what happened to Gunn: they had to use magic to make him smart.

Tempest: She appreciates [[Joss Whedon]] for getting the gender stuff right, but wishes he could get more than one thing right.

The urge to criticize is not entirely negative

Who is responsible? (producers, writers, directors?)

Wendy: Television is not made for us (the viewers) -- it’s made for advertisers. We are the product being delivered to the advertisers.

Audience member: “Is it a problem that I don’t care about the lack of people of color Buffy and Angel?”

Wendy: It’s all about coding. You can map yourself onto a character, even if they’re male, white, etc. until one day... “Hang on! I’m not going to grow up to be John Wayne!”

Audience member: Vancouver is actually full of Asians, so Ron Moore’s comment is bullshit.

Jacqueline: Fandom (Stargate: Atlantis) gets annoyed when actors of color are pointed out as such, because they are really ''aliens''.

How to fix problems?

Kate: Envision the future you want to live.

Tempest: Doesn’t have much faith that big media can be affected, because we don’t have access to the producers.

Wendy: Buy a bunch of copies of [[Writing the Other]] and mail them to TV producers (she’s serious).

Tayla & Chakotay as “native guides”, whereas Neelix is Sponge Bob.

Lack of people of color is bad world building. It “breaks the world” to have an all-white Sunnydale.

Tempest calls for media creative presence at conventions like WisCon. It would be great if creators had to attend panels like this to remain relevant.

Women, blacks, gays & lesbians in production positions don’t guarantee authenticity.

[[Heroes (TV series)|Heroes]] comes in for serious criticism.
*black criminal (D.L.)
*dead black woman (Simone)
*Latino drug addict (Isaac)
*the Haitian with no name

final wrap up:

Kate: “cultures are in a continual process of change”

Naamen: wants half Asian, half Latina lesbian woman as next Dr. Who incarnation

Tempest: The universe is so damn white because we let it be. Be activists! Get involved with blogging ([http://thehathorlegacy.info/ The Hathor Legacy], the People of Colour SF carnival). Write the stories, write the books, and when Hollywood comes calling don’t assume it’s going to be OK because Phillippa Boyens is involved, like [[Ursula K. Le Guin]] did with the SciFi production of [[Earthsea]].

== External Links ==

* [http://blog.wired.com/underwire/2007/05/fanblogging_wis.html Annalee Newitz] at UnderWire blog
* [http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x982281 same post, different thread]

[[Category:WisCon 31 panels]]