Feminist SF Wiki - User contributions [en]

Suzy McKee Charnas

2006-12-11T00:18:37Z

Glaurung quena: added to writers list

'''Suzy McKee Charnas''' (born [[1939]] in [[New York City]]) is an [[United States|American]] [[novel]]ist and [[short story]] writer, writing primarily in the genres of [[science fiction]] and [[fantasy]]. She has won several awards for her fiction, including the [[Hugo Award]], the [[Nebula Award]] and the [[James Tiptree, Jr. Award]]. She lives in [[New Mexico]].

== Bibliography ==

=== Novels ===

*''[[Dorothea Dreams]]'' ([[1986]])
*''[[The Kingdom of Kevin Malone]]'' ([[1993]])
*''[[The Ruby Tear]]'' ([[1997]])

=== Series ===

*[[The Holdfast Chronicles]]
**''[[Walk to the End of the World]]'' ([[1974]])
**''[[Motherlines]]'' ([[1978]])
**''[[The Furies]]'' ([[1994]])
**''[[The Conqueror's Child]]'' ([[1999]])

*[[Sorcery Hill]]
**''[[The Bronze King]]'' ([[1985]])
**''[[The Silver Glove]]'' ([[1988]])
**''[[The Golden Thread]]'' ([[1989]])

=== Collections ===

*''[[The Vampire Tapestry]]'' ([[1980]])
*''[[Moonstone and Tiger-Eye]]'' ([[1992]])
*''[[Music of the Night]]'' ([[2001]]) ''ebook''

=== Non-fiction ===

*''[[Strange Seas]]'' ([[2001]]) ''ebook''
*''[[My Father's Ghost]]'' ([[2002]])

=== Notable Short Works ===

*"[[Scorched Supper on New Niger]]" ([[1980]])
*"[[Unicorn Tapestry]]" ([[1980]])
*"[[Listening to Brahms]]" ([[1988]])
*"[[Boobs (short story)|Boobs]]" ([[1989]])

== External links ==

* [http://www.suzymckeecharnas.com/ The web site of Suzy McKee Charnas.]

[[Category:Writers|Charnas, Suzy McKee]]
[[Category:1939 Births|Charnas, Suzy McKee]]
[[Category:American science fiction writers|Charnas, Suzy McKee]]
[[Category:Fantasy writers|Charnas, Suzy McKee]]
[[Category:Hugo Award winning authors|Charnas, Suzy McKee]]
[[Category:Nebula Award winning authors|Charnas, Suzy McKee]]
[[Category:Living people|Charnas, Suzy McKee]]
[[category:Tiptree Award Winning Authors|Charnas, Suzy McKee]]

Joanna Russ

2006-12-11T00:15:28Z

Glaurung quena: added to writers category

Joanna Russ (born 22 February 1937), American writer, pioneer of feminist science fiction, essayist.

== Bibliography ==

=== Novels ===
* ''[[Picnic on Paradise]]'' ([[1968]])
* ''[[And Chaos Died]]'' ([[1970]])
* ''[[The Female Man]]'' ([[1975]])
* ''[[We Who Are About To...]]'' ([[1977]])
* ''[[Kittatinny: A Tale of Magic]]'' ([[1978]])
* ''[[The Two of Them]]'' ([[1978]])
* ''[[On Strike Against God]]'' ([[1980]])

=== Collections ===
* ''[[The Adventures of Alyx]]'' ([[1976]])
* ''[[The Zanzibar Cat]]'' ([[1983]])
* ''[[Extra(Ordinary) People]]'' ([[1985]])
* ''[[The Hidden Side of the Moon]]'' ([[1987]])

=== Nonfiction ===
* "[[The Image of Women in Science Fiction]]" ([[1971]])
* ''[[How to Suppress Women's Writing]]'' ([[1983]])
* ''[[Magic Mommas, Trembling Sisters, Puritans & Perverts: Feminist Essays]]'' ([[1985]])
* ''[[To Write Like a Woman: Essays in Feminism and Science Fiction]]'' ([[1995]])
* ''[[What Are We Fighting For? Sex, Race, Class, and the Future of Feminism]]'' ([[1998]])
* ''[[The Country You Have Never Seen]]'' (forthcoming)

=== Notable Short Stories ===
* "[[The Zanzibar Cat (story)|The Zanzibar Cat]]" ([[1971]])
* "[[When It Changed]]" ([[1972]])
* "[[Souls]]" ([[1982]])

=== Interviews ===

* Interviewed by [[Samuel R. Delany]] at [[WisCon 30]] (2006)

[[category:Writers|Russ, Joanna]]
[[category:1937 Births|Russ, Joanna]]
[[category:Hugo Award winning authors|Russ, Joanna]]
[[category:Nebula Award winning authors|Russ, Joanna]]
[[category:Tiptree Award Winning Authors|Russ, Joanna]]

Jean Auel

2006-12-11T00:07:34Z

Glaurung quena: added bibliography and brief description of the series

Jean M Auel is the author of the "Earth's Children" series. Perhaps best described as "prehistoric romance," the books are set during the last ice age and chronicle the life of a Cro Magnon woman named Ayla.

==Bibliography==
The Clan of the Cave Bear
The Valley of Horses
The Mammoth Hunters
The Plains of Passage
The Shelters of Stone

[[category:1936 Births|Auel, Jean]]
[[category:Writers|Auel, Jean]]

Margaret Atwood

2006-12-10T23:57:04Z

Glaurung quena: /* Intertextual References */

==Selected Bibliography==

* ''[[The Handmaid's Tale]]''
* ''[[The Robber Bride]]'' (1993)
* ''[[Oryx and Crake]]''
* ''[[Good Bones and Simple Murders]]'' (short stories)

==Intertextual References==

Margaret Atwood, who mostly writes mainstream fiction but has also written some science fiction, has been known to speak disparagingly of the genre. At one point she described it as "talking squids in outer space". A website was created to honor this vision of science fiction. http://www.talkingsquidsinouterspace.com/

[[category:1939 Births|Atwood, Margaret]]
[[category:Female Writers|Atwood, Margaret]]
[[category:Canadian Writers|Atwood, Margaret]]
[[Category:Writers|Atwood, Margaret]]
[[Category:Living people|Atwood]]

Talk:Humorless feminism

2006-12-10T23:30:29Z

Glaurung quena: Reordering sections?

always interesting to see where people go ... i was thinking primarily of research focusing on comedy and humor that looks at gender distinctions, and the history of women's humor; and how that ties into aspersions cast on women and feminists. glad to see others raising the issues of sexist/racist/prejudicial humor, although it seems (to me) to be a somewhat different (albeit related) issue. ... certainly the relations of prejudicial humor to oppression/hierarchical class structures is an interesting topic that we have only begun to hint at. (probably we need to flesh out the further readings, though, because they primarily address the first issue--women's/feminist sense of humor or lack thereof. i haven't done much reading on the uses of prejudicial humor, so hopefully someone else can add some supportive "further readings"? )--[[User:Lquilter|LQ]] 09:25, 10 December 2006 (PST)

[http://ide-cyan.livejournal.com/1021698.html MISPLACED FUCKING CHIVALRY]. --[[User:Ide Cyan|Ide Cyan]] 11:01, 10 December 2006 (PST)

: Actually, rather than simply reversing without explanation, it would probably be more constructive to explain what was problematic in the edits. Whatever the reasoning behind people's contributions, I think it would be better to let them stand on their own. I liked some of the edits & think reverting with such evident hostility discourages participation. --[[User:Lquilter|LQ]] 11:07, 10 December 2006 (PST)

:: Info concerning sexist humour per se belongs in a fucking different ENTRY THAN THIS ONE. And THIS here is a case of a guy stepping in to be effective ON MY BEHALF when he had NO FUCKING IDEA what I wanted to do, and I DO NOT THINK MY HOSTILITY IS MISPLACED. AT ALL. --[[User:Ide Cyan|Ide Cyan]] 11:09, 10 December 2006 (PST)

:::What? I'm reading some of the stuff that got deleted now and it's cool and I'd like to put some of it back. Esp. the stuff about verbal self defense. I'm not seeing where all the hostility is... it seems like a good article in the making. Ide, if there are things you disagree with I would favor separating them out, like "on the one hand, this point of view, and also...." It is unlikely that collectively we will produce something where we all agree with every point. I am just learning through doing on Wiki writing, like many of us. But it seems that before I deleted big chunks of someone's work or reverted it, I would open discussion with them of why and would suggest a restructuring that didn't erase their efforts, which could be extremely discouraging. By saying this, I don't want to be discouraging of you, Ide, but I want to suggest a more open line of communication. I do believe that there could be situations where it is best to shut down a discussion, or discourage or kick out a person, but those should be for extreme cases of trolling or "invasion", I think, and this does not seem like that kind of situation to me. :Liz Henry|Liz Henry]] 11:17, 10 December 2006 (PST)

::::: Coming in from a link on MY LIVEJOURNAL to do an edit and usurping my bloody agency FUCKING COUNTS AS AN INVASION. HELL. Why am I THE ONLY ONE SEEING THIS?!?!? --[[User:Ide Cyan|Ide Cyan]] 11:24, 10 December 2006 (PST)

:::: (A) I'm not sure this person is a guy. Maybe you have some extra knowledge on that point but it's not evident from anything I see in the posting or user profile. (B) From the (relative) outside, looking in, the edits themselves look pretty useful and interesting. I agree that some of them are a different topic (as I said at the top comment) but that just means we could split them out to separate articles, not delete. (C) I didn't say your hostility was misplaced; I have no idea where it comes from -- maybe you have other interactions with this person, whatever -- I just said that evident hostility discourages participation. --[[User:Lquilter|LQ]] 11:19, 10 December 2006 (PST)

::: So I'm the only one who sees the FUCKING IRONY in you two leaping to defend those changes while I'm here in the fucking humourless feminist role, huh? HA BLOODY HA. --[[User:Ide Cyan|Ide Cyan]] 11:22, 10 December 2006 (PST)

:::: No, I see your point that you don't like your ideas that are under development to be edited by a guy (?) who you don't know or trust. But I would like us on the wiki to talk and explain reasons... that's why I'm talking now. --[[User:Liz Henry|Liz Henry]] 11:28, 10 December 2006 (PST)

::::: It ISN'T about my not "knowing" or not "trusting" the guy in question. It is FUCKING ANTIFEMINIST FOR A MAN TO USURP A WOMAN'S AGENCY. I'm not going to be fucking liberated by CHIVALRY. --[[User:Ide Cyan|Ide Cyan]] 11:30, 10 December 2006 (PST)

:::::: Ide I am not getting where there is chivalry or denial of agency. Isn't it a collaborative article... When I edit someone's page that they're working on, I do it from a spirit of friendliness, engaging with them, pitching in, and not to usurp "their" subject. Is there something specific that was deleted, changed, or said by the person you reverted, that was objectionable...that was condescendingly "chivalrous"? --[[User:Liz Henry|Liz Henry]] 11:41, 10 December 2006 (PST)

::::::: PRESUMING TO READ MY MIND IS PRETTY FUCKING CONDESCENDING. He has NO IDEA what I want. And then giving me what he ''presumes'', without any fucking basis, would make the entry "less painful", that is DOUBLY condescending. --[[User:Ide Cyan|Ide Cyan]] 11:44, 10 December 2006 (PST)

:::::::: But from my point of view it seems to me more that the person likes your way of thinking, admires you perhaps, and was trying (perhaps clumsily from your pt of view) to work with you... not to fix everything for you, but to engage with how you think; maybe even to impress you, or again, out of friendliness and intellectual agreement/desire to collaborate. I know what you mean about when people (male or female) leap in to "fix" a situation that you're working through for yourself. (BTW I don't know what made the article painful in the first place for you but am willing to listen.)

::::::::: I saw Ide Cyan's post on LJ and was interested to see what was wrong with the humourless feminism page. I followed the link, read the article, and wanted to revise it. My reply to her post was intended to let her know that I had made changes which I hoped were useful. No invasion, condescension, or chivalry was intended. [[User:Glaurung quena|Glaurung]] 15:07, 10 December 2006 (PST)
----

The subject of humorless feminism is on my mind lately because of the Hitchens article that was so damned obnoxious. In fact Charlie was just joking about it onstage last night and then at dinner we all made fun of Hitchens until we almost peed our pants. [http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/features/2007/01/hitchens200701 horrid article about how women aren't funny] --[[User:Liz Henry|Liz Henry]] 11:36, 10 December 2006 (PST)

: [http://wiki.feministsf.net/index.php?title=Sexist_Humor&action=edit HERE]!!! Get your pipin' hot NEW page about [[Sexist Humor]] and edit it separately! --[[User:Ide Cyan|Ide Cyan]] 11:40, 10 December 2006 (PST)

== "attacking on pretensions of humor" ==

actually i think the move that i was describing is only sometimes "attacking on pretension of humor". i think often the assertion of "humorous intent" is a retcon, just a defense response to perceived criticism. i'd rather have that point made clearly. --[[User:Lquilter|LQ]] 12:00, 10 December 2006 (PST)

== Reordering sections? ==

I think the article's sections could be reordered. I suggest folding sexist/gendered humour into one category (there are gendered jokes, and then there are _offensive_ gendered jokes) and putting it on top, since feminists' refusal to accept/play along with offensive/misogynist jokes seems to me to be the biggest reason for the existence of the stereotype. [[User:Glaurung quena|Glaurung]] 15:30, 10 December 2006 (PST)

Talk:Humorless feminism

2006-12-10T23:07:07Z

Glaurung quena:

Humorless feminism

2006-12-10T17:03:00Z

Glaurung quena:

Feminists are routinely lampooned as humorless creatures, as in the classic joke: ''Q: How many feminists does it take to change a lightbulb? A: That's not funny!'' (that actually is kind of funny, at least to some feminists).

There are several reasons for this:

==Sexist humor==
As openly declared prejudice against ethnic groups is no longer considered acceptable, humor based on ethnic stereotypes (polak jokes, for example) has also declined. Sexism is still culturally acceptable in many quarters, however, and so is sexist humor (blonde jokes, for example).

Feminists who try to point out that a sexist joke is offensive are often accused of lacking a sense of humor, as this response allows the jester to deny that there was anything offensive about the joke.

==Attacking under pretense of humor==
In her "Verbal Self Defense" books, linguist Suzette Haden Elgin has identified several types of covert verbal attacks. These are ways that a verbal bully can attack their victim subtly. If the victim calls the bully on their attack, one way for the bully to maintain the pretense that they were not actually attacking would be to claim that their verbal attack was not intended seriously: "can't you take a joke?"

In Haden Elgin's books, the bully and victim can be any gender. But when the bully is sexist or misogynist, then we get something like this:

A: Women can't drive.
B: You know, that's really not true, and in fact is a sexist generalization.
A: Geez, feminists have got no sense of humor.

By pretending that he was "only joking," A distances himself from his original sexist remark (de-escalating his attack), and stifles B's criticism of his sexist attitude as being "humorless."

==Gendered humor==
Many jokes poke fun at (stereotypes of) men and women. Because society is male dominated, jokes that make fun of women are far more common. If the joke has a biting or misogynist edge, women are unlikely to find the joke funny.

A sexist double standard works in this situation: a woman who responds to such jokes by telling a similarly sharp joke that makes fun of men will be told (by men) "that's not funny," while a woman who responds to such jokes by saying that the woman-hating joke is not funny will be told that she is a humorless feminist.

==Attacks on women as humorless==

In part because of the gendered nature of humor and the double standard (that making fun of women is OK, but making fun of men is not), women are supposed to be somehow less funny than men, or funny only in particular ways (self-deprecating humor, menstrual humor). Female comedians have faced the typical sexist barriers, but also had to combat the notion that women, somehow, are inherently incapable of doing humor.

Gloria Kaufman (''In Stitches: A Patchwork of Feminist Humor and Satire'') and [[Rosalind Warren|Roz Warren]] (''The Best Contemporary Women's Humor''; ''Women's Glibber: State-of-the-Art Women's Humor'') discuss this false notion, and their books constitute a debunking of it.

The stereotype of women as humorless has shaped the history of women as professional comedians, and affected the portrayal of female characters in fictional works. Numerous anti-feminist works have portrayed matriarchal or egalitarian rule as humorless or joyless. For example, Robert Chambers' ''The Gay Rebellion'' (1913)

In fact, of course, humor is a survival response and coping mechanism for oppressed groups or underclasses, including women. Satirical humor mocking the privileged and the entire system of privilege (patriarchy) is one direction of humor, and one which may seem particularly un-funny to folks who support patriarchal norms.

==Further reading==

* Regina Barreca, ''Last Laughs: Perspectives on Women and Comedy'' (1988)
* Regina Barreca, ''They Used to Call Me Snow White ... But I Drifted'' (1992) (essays & theory)
* Regina Barreca, ''The Penguin Book of Women's Humor: Women's Strategic Use of Humor''
* Denise Collier and Kathleen Beckett, editors, ''Spare Ribs: Women in the Humor Biz'' (1980) (anthology of interviews with female comedians)
* Nancy Davis, ''Creme de la Femme: A Collection of the Best Contemporary Women Writers, Lyricists, Playwrights and Cartoonists'' (1997) (anthology of women's humor)
* Gloria Kaufman, editor, ''In Stitches: A Patchwork of Feminist Humor and Satire'' (1991) (anthology)
* Gloria Kaufman, ''Pulling Our Own Strings: Feminist Humor and Satire'' (anthology)
* Ann E. Larson & Carole A. Carr, ''Silverleaf's Choice: An Anthology of Lesbian Humor'' (1990) (anthology)
* Linda Morris, ''American Women Humorists: Critical Essays'' (1994) (anthology of critical essays)
* Trina Robbins & Catherine Yronwode, ''Women and the Comics'' (1983) (anthology)
* Trina Robbins, ''A Century of Women Cartoonists'' (1993) (anthology)
* June Sochen, ''Women's Comic Visions'' (1991)
* Nancy Walker & Zita Dresner, editors, ''American Women's Literary Humor from Colonial Times to the 1980s'' (1988) (anthology of humor)
* Nancy Walker, ''A Very Serious Thing: Women's Humor and American Culture'' (1988)
* [[Rosalind Warren]], ''Women's Glib'' series (anthologies of humor)
* Roz Warren, ''Revolutionary Laughter: The World of Women Comics'' (anthology of interviews with female comedians)
* Roz Warren, ''Dyke Strippers: Lesbian Cartoonists A to Z'' (anthology of humor)
* special issues/focuses in ''Ms.'', ''Bust'', ''Bitch'' magazine
** Andi Zeisler, "Funny Girls Get No Respect," ''Bitch'' magazine

[[Category:Feminism]]